Three Steps to Gaining Traction with Ketan Patel and Ardijan Hasandzekaj

Episode 181 of the Diary of an Apartment Investor Podcast with Ketan Patel and Ardijan Hasandzekaj. Transcript by – please forgive any errors.

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Brian Briscoe 0:00

This is Brian brisco, hosts the diary apartment investor, podcast and partner at four oaks capital. So we have something that we've been working on for a really long time we are building and we'll continue to build an educational community that we're calling the tribe of Titans. And it's going to be a community of multifamily investors based around education and his house on the mighty networks. What you're gonna find in there is a lot of events that are exclusive to the tribe of Titans members a tonne of educational content, and you're gonna find great people. So if you're listening to this podcast, because you're looking for community or you're looking for education, go no further the tribe of Titans is something you need to look into for the price of about $1 a day, you're going to be able to have access to everything that we have an elder content that we continue to produce for years to come. And just so there's no pressure and there's no obligation, the first month is free. So sign up first month free, and give it a test drive if you'd like to keep hanging out and you'll continue to have access to Well, me and my partners are four oaks capital in a lot of other experience and aspiring investors. And where can you find it the tribe of Titans dot info. There's a link to that at the bottom of the show notes of every single episode right now. So if you're interested, type in www dot the tribe of Titans dot info or go down to this bottom on the show notes and just tap the link Hey Ardijan. We got Keaton on the line here, what you want to ask him in the real estate arena,

Ardijan Hasandzekaj 1:23

what would you say would be the three actionable steps that you would give somebody that's just starting out to you know, achieve their goal of gaining traction?

Ketan Patel 1:32

I would say step number one having some kind of weekly reflection routine, it might take a little while but this is the best hour you could invest in yourself as a real estate investor. Second thing would be figuring out you know what's going on with the fear limiting belief and we all have it a certain point. So what what is that specific fear a limiting belief and once we have it, we could start challenging it. The third important thing is really paying attention to the strategy. We all have different skill sets, we have different goals. So how do we create a strategy that just works best for us?

Brian Briscoe 2:16

Welcome to the diary apartment investor podcast with your host Brian brisco. In this podcast, we bring some of the top professionals in the apartment investment field to discuss various aspects of the apartment investing journey with the sole purpose of educating listeners to make wise investment decisions. The Diary of an apartment investor podcast is sponsored by four oaks capital bringing you high yield returns through apartment complex investing. Welcome to the diary of an apartment investor podcast. I'm your host Brian Briscoe with four oaks capital another great show for you today. We've got two amazing people on the line with us. We've got Keaton Patel, our experienced investor, and already has son jucai. Already was that close enough? That's just about right, buddy. All right, perfect. All right. So you will get into both of your guys's backgrounds here. But as most people know, you know, the experienced investor is usually up to the plate first. So Keton, welcome to the show.

Ketan Patel 3:11

Thank you so much, Brian, and nice to meet you already. And excited to be on the show and talking with you guys today.

Brian Briscoe 3:17

Yeah, thanks a lot. So would you do us a favour and tell us a little bit about yourself where you're from, and you kind of walk us along the road of how you got into apartment investing?

Ketan Patel 3:28

Yeah, so a little bit about me originally, I'm an immigrant from India. I came here when I was 19. I got my doctor or pharmacy at an accelerated pace. And I was practising pharmacy, and I realised I just don't want to rely on this w two income. So I started buying rentals, creating a rental portfolio on the side. And that whole passive income journey was going too slow. So I ended up buying another business in senior care industry, put it on autopilot, and I realised that capital raising and then also scaling is the key in real estate business. And then that's how that's what led me into apartment syndication.

Brian Briscoe 4:07

Alright, so first of all, I've got a lot of respect for for anybody who immigrates here, I spent a lot of time outside of the country and lived overseas for a total of six, seven years now. But like I said, tonnes of respect, it's not easy. It's not easy to be playing, you know, come out of one culture and integrate into another so tonnes of respect on that one and she got your doctor and pharmacy and something that you mentioned that I think comes up a lot is you didn't want to be tied to that one income. Something else that comes up a lot is you started out small and set and realise I fail something so let's look at kind of dive into that a little more. You know, so what did what were your first forays into real estate investing? What did that look like?

Ketan Patel 4:50

Yeah, so the very first thing was was $106,000 house I only needed 25,000 which I didn't have, and I knew that you know At the end of the day, if I'm not committed, and if I'm not looking at possibilities, I'm not going to go that far. Instead of saying I don't have the money, or the knowledge or the networking, which are, you know, the big reasons, I figured I found two pharmacists to basically partner come up with $1,000 each. And now my problem became from 25,000, to eight. So then what I did is I opened up a 401k account with my employer, and they were giving a loan out on it, and I use that money to buy that very first deal. And at that time, I didn't really knew how things would scale and where I would eventually end up. But I was very excited about, you know, entrepreneurship, taking risk learning and creativity and all that.

Brian Briscoe 5:44

Yeah, you know, I will say something that, you know, people who aren't afraid to take risks are usually the ones that end up hitting a big, you know, and I like how you said that know a whole lot about it, you saw an opportunity there. And I love how you got creative with that, you know, you went to a couple of buddies yours, like, you turn a $25,000 problem into an $8,000 problem. And like I said, I like like how you phrase that too. So partner together with a couple of guys, you even got creative coming up with your $8,000. And you got into your first deal. Great, great. How did you how did things go from there? I mean, how did that work out? that deal worked out? And then you had that lead into what was coming up later?

Ketan Patel 6:23

Yeah, so the deal actually was not working out at all, we had tenants that were not paying, this is the first tenant, I'm a brand new landlord. And it was quite a bit of challenge. But I realised that any business sooner or later, it's just a matter of time, when things are going to come in your way, am I going to let this thing define me? Or am I just going to put little bit work and understand what to do next to avoid this situation. And then I ended up buying a couple more single family homes, and then things were a little better there. And then I realised, okay, let's start to scale. So then I got into three, four or five unit buildings. Nice, nice. And, you know, once again, another little key there was was the mindset you have going yet, you know, you looked at it, you had a problem. And you know, instead of running away from the problem, you figured out how to solve it, and how to how to turn it into basically how to systematise thing and to begin that the scaling operation. So now as far as the next couple of purchases, you say, you know, small multifamily, where where were you purchasing at the time, they were all here in Massachusetts in a particular sub market that I went to school, and I kind of knew the area in the numbers of purchase to rent, it just made a lot of sense to me. Nice, nice. So

Brian Briscoe 7:45

in your in your backyard is a lot of people will say is my opinion has always been if you can buy stuff in your backyard, that's the easiest place to invest, you know, you turn your very detailed knowledge of a small sub market into something that was, you know, presumably profitable for you. I mean, I kept on buying and must have at least been profitable to begin with.

Ketan Patel 8:07

Absolutely, all of the deals I bought through the process, you know, I'm hitting more than 15 17% cash on cash, and it's appreciating and all that. But eventually, I realise it's not the step one is making money, unlocking some opportunities. But step two is systemising. And scaling, if we don't do that, then what happens is, we are just putting a lot of time again, we don't have a job, we're creating a job for ourselves just to make money in real estate. But we are back at that same conundrum. So it is yeah, that where we started at

Brian Briscoe 8:41

the same problem that you're trying to get away from was that that single income that you're reliant on, and I think you make an excellent point there, you know, if you're not careful, you're you're jumping from the frying pan to the fryer so to speak, you're jumping from, you know, dependent on one income from in your case, you know, pharmacy, you say say you're working in a pharmacy, I need to be able to document pharmacy, right? Yeah, I was working as a pharmacist. Yeah. Yeah. So so you see one income, you know, single income as a pharmacist to a single income as a, you know, real estate professionals. So, you know, good, good point there. And you gotta, you gotta be careful that you don't fall right back into that same routine and something else. So, so let's talk about scaling. From there. You talked about, you know, realising that you needed to scale, how did you take the next step and, and start to scale and start to systematise things from there?

Ketan Patel 9:32

Yeah, so I realise, you know, then at that time, when I was acquiring the other deals, I was still working as a pharmacist, and I knew that, you know, my commitment needs to be there more. So I figured out for me to buy all these rental properties to replace my income, that's a strategy but it's gonna need me five, maybe seven years, which is not aligning with me. So I ended up buying a business and I was telling myself rather than going to business school and people 60 grand a year, why don't I buy a business, I know nothing about turning around, that will be my own MBA. So that's exactly what I did. I bought a senior care business, turn it around, put the management in place. So now working less than one day a week, I could live comfortably and I have time, which is even valuable that that money. And now I could use that time to scale, whether it's just, you know, let's, you know, build a business where I'm flipping more or developing. But for me, it was more about raising money, because I also realise we run out of money sooner or later. It's just a matter of time, right? There's only so much we could invest. So I figured, let me get into more units. And let me get into the money raising side. So I built my brand, got investors started with friends and family. And I started plugging that money with a sponsor that has already executed some deals. They even had an exit. And that was my way to scale and put system and transition into something bigger.

Brian Briscoe 11:02

Nice, nice. Now, when you're doing deals now, do you stick with the same sponsor? Or do you have several sponsors that you'll partner with?

Ketan Patel 11:10

Yeah, so right now, I also got a broker dealer affiliation I got through the securities exams last year. So now I do have the option to partner with whoever and I could get compensated on raising capital. But I still strictly focus on one sponsor, because a lot of my time goes into my personal development and coaching clients around the mindset in fear and building the strategy. So I'm happy with just picking a sponsor or two and raising capital for them. Nice, nice. And something you mentioned, you know, just having the securities. certification, I

Brian Briscoe 11:47

think is what it is, but you're able to basically, I'm not saying skirt, but you're you have a lot more flexibility than somebody who's raising capital for like a 506 B or a 506. c, because, you know, since since you have the certifications you need, you can be compensated, like you said, you can be compensated just for raising money and dropping money in there. Because you are licenced to sell securities and broker security. So, I think that's, that's really, really big and something that I just wanted to bring up. I know a lot of, you know, capital raisers who, when they're first trying don't quite understand, you know, that the SEC regulations, and you've actually set yourself self up very well, so that you can essentially sell the securities come in, bring money to a deal, and not not have to worry about the SEC regulations as far as that goes. But that said, you know, why? Why did you choose one sponsor? Why Why did you choose the one sponsor that you you've done most your deals with?

Ketan Patel 12:51

Yeah, so I also realise real estate is not really a transaction business. It's a relationship business, so to speak, right? In the important point is finding partners or mentors, or whoever you're doing business with, they have an alignment in terms of values, right? Are these folks that have integrity, that they are going to do best for their investors or whoever that's doing business with them? That's more important after that comes in? How good? Are they sticking with the strategy in discipline? What are their processes and systems? Are they upgrading? What are their goals? These are the questions I try to answer. And not a lot of folks pass through, you know, the entire model with this particular sponsor data. And then I also realise the investors were very favourable, they were happy to invest, they have done some exits, they are happy with the returns, and everything just made sense to stick around with them. And I have been researching and reaching out to other sponsors as well. But I also realised not to jump into things fast, since I have the option of having multiple income streams, I just don't have to rely where sometimes you're in a position where you have to raise money, you don't have an option. And in that case, you might just ended up you know, making a mistake, or you have to versus I have the luxury not to really expand as much if I if I choose to which which I'm grateful for. So

Brian Briscoe 14:19

yeah, and that brings up a really good point in this is just like any other business, you know, people have to feed their families, they have to, you know, pay their living expenses. But you know, when sponsors get to the point to where they have to close a deal to make ends meet at home, I think they tend to stretch the numbers. And you know, you're you're in a spot where if the deal doesn't work, you're not worried about that. So you can you can focus, you know, focus your efforts on making sure that you have good quality products for your investors. And in turn, you know that that ends up being good for you because you're always putting good quality products in front of people you're not, you're not trying to turn a a b plus product into an A plus product or a C minus product and an aka product. But anyway, good, good, good points there. So a question that I like to ask everybody you know, and gets down to the motivation, you know, what's your big burning? Why? Yeah, my

Ketan Patel 15:13

big burning, why I've been always motivated in the potential that we all have. But I've always seen that it's always a case of fear or limiting belief that we are not really conscious of, we all could be doing so much more in our own ways, right, what we desire, but these unconscious programmes and things just come into way. So for me is just to drive myself push myself to grow, learn as much as I can, and then support other people, whether it's through my coaching programme, or books, or talking events or YouTube video, whatever that is, because I realise ultimately, it's just a collective growing, it's just not me meeting my needs nothing wrong with it. But after a while, the point comes where you just want to involve more people, and I'm just figuring out new and new ways before it was raising capital and serving investors, which I do now is just helping real estate entrepreneurs get to their goals, basically.

Brian Briscoe 16:11

Yeah. And I mean, something you mentioned that the limiting beliefs, I think everybody's hampered by, by limiting beliefs. You know, and you talked about some things that I think a lot of people would would call scary. You talked about, you know, buying a business without knowing you talked about jumping into your first investment, you know, without a whole lot of knowledge, which, you know, I think for a lot of people that are big, big hurdles, did you have any limiting beliefs you had to overcome to get to those steps? And how did you do that?

Ketan Patel 16:40

Absolutely great, great question. I have limiting beliefs. And I realised the more we grow, the more refined right and to go back when I bought the business and left pharmacy, I had dead of student loan in six figures. I had lost everything I've saved with another, another business venture. And you know, I'm like, is this a good time, and I realised there's never a good time, so to speak, we wait for a good time, whether in terms of family, or something with the real estate cycle or what not, but it's just an excuse that the mind conjures up. And in reality, the fear of you know, something not working out, it's just a fear. In reality, even if you lose money, even if something doesn't work out, it's not end of the world, it's not end of your life, you will figure something out, you will get some feedback, you will get some experience, you'll make some context. And you'll go ahead, right. So I will recommend folks number one thing is to figure out what their those particular limiting beliefs are. Because otherwise, it's like fighting an enemy in the dark. We really don't know what that is. But we feel, you know, stuck or not making progress in once they know that, okay, this is this specific feeling or belief that, for example, I don't want to buy my first property because I'm afraid, you know, I might lose their money, or what if I get a bad tenant and I don't make any money. So once we are specific with those beliefs, then we could do something with it, we have to start challenging them. How are other folks doing that have jobs, and they are buying an apartment complex? Something's not right. I have to question this belief in theirs more things, you know, along this avenue, so

Brian Briscoe 18:23

yeah, absolutely. And I appreciate that. I think for the longest time, you know, I had a limiting belief. I remember reading Rich Dad, Poor Dad, it was like 2004 2005 timeframe. And he talks a lot about commercial real estate. And I remember thinking, that sounds too complicated. I had a limited limiting belief that I could not do commercial real estate. And fortunately, I started buying single family properties. But it wasn't until many years later that I look back at that and said, Oh my gosh, I've had these limiting beliefs that have been holding me back. And I think once you start realising that you start noticing, you know, when you say things that are limiting when you when you actually think things are limiting, and you start noticing that you have these limiting beliefs and I like what you say it's you go from fighting an enemy in the dark to understanding exactly what it is it's holding you back and you can attack it directly but love it love the love what you've brought to the show so far. But anyway, one thing that I also like to talk is just a little more specifics on on some of the multifamily deals, what what type of deals do you look for, you know, what do you like to invest in and the type of things that you're bringing your investors to as well?

Ketan Patel 19:38

Yeah, so you know, as we know, there are so many strategies in the multifamily arena, but I typically like big metros, surrounding big metros, and I like 250 unit plus deals with the strategy of you know, c plus b minus and just giving it a notch up. That's something I like what we would call middle risk Miller of return. Right versus something that's distressed, or just Class A and I like to have really the area of your buying some kind of job growth headquarters moving in. so to speak, population increases, because all these things are going to drive up the demand. And ideally, somewhere where you know, the value add is a mixture of both things, we are not just relying on bumping up the rents inside the units, but there's something you could do operationally, something you could do it with the capital stack, you know, leveraging financing piece, or something that's outside, maybe it's a carport or a dog park or rebranding, the names, those kind of things as well. All that stuff adding up and ideally, something very, you know, the expense ratios we could bring down from the current management and where there's a proven demand in the area surrounding it, where people are paying premiums, so it takes a little bit of risk and guesswork out. That's something that I like to invest in most of the deals I invest, I like, I also invest alongside with my investors as well.

Brian Briscoe 21:07

Yeah. Yeah, a lot, a lot of gold nuggets there, you know, the larger metros, you know that the cap rates are lower in the larger metros, because it's that there's less risk there, you know, if you look at cap rates as a indication of risk, you know, that that's what you're looking for looking for them large metros, because there's a little less risk, you're looking for 250 above, because there's a little bit less risk, you're looking for the areas that are growing, because there's less risk there. And I think you hit the nail on the head, you know, everything that you said, tends to have, you know, lower risks to it, which, you know, typically you end up with lower term returns, then, you know, maybe some of the guys in other areas and other, you know, business plans have, but end of the day, you know, you're giving, you're you're very likely giving much more stable returns to the investors. Yeah.

Ketan Patel 21:57

And to add to it, my outlook and I tell investors often is it's not about investing in a deal as an LP and making the most return. It's about a long term game plan. And you know, what we might have an investment that might not work out, or something that's producing a lot of return. But having a long term view, and learning and growing, your model is going to serve better instead of just looking for that golden nugget deal. And just hoping for that, and then you know, you sometimes you spend two years not investing because you know, we haven't found that deal. And now the time value of money, right? All of that stuff comes into play. So

Brian Briscoe 22:35

absolutely all part of a larger, you know, investment, philosophy investment portfolio there. But that's, that's great. One question that I also like to ask everybody and see what's coming up on your radar. What's next for you?

Ketan Patel 22:49

Yeah, for me, the next thing is just scaling. I have built models on you know, how to get over a limiting beliefs, how to have clarity how to have a strategy, but there's only so many people I could support in one on one coaching. So I'm working on you know, publishing this content in a book speaking at conferences, just more group coaching, leveraging all that so I could support more people that with my ideas and what I've learned and all that.

Brian Briscoe 23:14

Yeah, amazing. Amazing. That said, let's shift gears a little bit, and we're gonna bring already on the show. So our welcome. Thank you, Brian, for having me. Yeah, yeah. Great, great meeting you and for anybody listening, you know, already and I met face to face in Dallas a couple weeks ago. So very excited to see you again. And happy to have you on the show. Likewise, thank you. picador. Nice. Nice to meet you as well. All right, already. Same first question for you, you know, would you please introduce yourself, tell us about you and kind of lead us into what got you into real estate?

Ardijan Hasandzekaj 23:48

Yeah, well, as I said, my name is Adi, I'm originally from Kosovo came here, when I was about 1718. It was a complicated situation, but I ended up coming here and kind of just like, a lot of immigrant stories, you know, you start off slow, and you know, education is always like, on the top of your list. I, you know, went to school, and, you know, I had a dream of becoming a physician. And that took me a while to get to that one. Eventually, I got there. And, you know, I've been doing it for over 10 years now. And as much as I enjoy it, you know, I think my next step was trying to create more time, so I could do things that I've, you know, missed doing for years, you know, while I was in school and, and chasing my, you know, dream, you know, I kind of left a lot of things on done. And so that was, you know, that's where I'm at at this point in time. Yeah.

Brian Briscoe 24:47

Interesting. And yeah, same. Same thing I said to Keaton earlier, you know, definitely have a lot of respect for immigrants. And you know, you say complicated I can only imagine how complicated your life was in Kosovo. I mean, midnight. In the early mid 90s, anything could happen out there and go into the early 2000s as well. So

Ardijan Hasandzekaj 25:05

you're familiar with it since you've been in the armed forces, so you know exactly what happened. But yeah,

Brian Briscoe 25:10

yeah, yep. I know, I know what happened that was slightly before my time. You know, I didn't I didn't join until I was 24, you know, had I had I joined the military right out of high school, you know, I probably would have served, you know, a two or two and in that area, so, you know, a lot of stuff going on, you know, and a lot of a lot of turmoil and strife. And hence, you have a lot of people from Kosovo that, you know, we're looking for fertile ground. So, yeah. Yeah. So physician trying to get your time back. Is that is that basically what what I heard from your story?

Ardijan Hasandzekaj 25:45

Yeah, basically, I mean, you know, there's so many facets of what, you know, what the reasons are, but but the big Why is, you know, family and spending time with my daughter, I have a one year old daughter now. And, you know, seeing her grow and being able to be with her and sharing experiences and teaching her things. And being there for her. It's, I mean, it's, you know, it's one of the most important things in my life now. And I would like to, you know, do that. And so that's basically the the big lie for me.

Brian Briscoe 26:17

All right. Yeah, I think we all have all have various y's in his family is one thing that keeps on coming up and up and up again, knowing. And part of the reason I jumped in, you know, part of my big brain, why was exactly that to spend more time with my kids, you know, but anyway, that said, already, we got keynote, Keaton on the line here. What do you want to ask him?

Ardijan Hasandzekaj 26:38

Yeah, kidding. I've actually heard you before. And I was quite impressed with with your story as well. And I guess, the big question that I would have, given the fact that you are coaching others to, you know, overcome their limiting beliefs and become a better version of themselves, specifically in the real estate arena, like what would you say, would be the three actionable steps that you would give somebody that is just starting out to, you know, achieve their goal of gaining traction?

Ketan Patel 27:07

Yeah. Okay. That's, that's a great question. Right. So in terms of three steps, I would say step number one, would be having some kind of weekly reflection routine, like, let's just say, and this is something I used to do years ago, we take one hour or two hours a week, go to a coffee shop, or somewhere where you're completely not disturbed your phone's off. And all you want to do is really reflect how did I do this week? Did I worked on the goals? Did I took action to move in the direction I want to go? If the answer is no, it's not about beating yourself down. But it's just going to bring the awareness because a lot of times, we want to get here. And we are here some things in the middle. We really don't know what that is in until we really know we can't really go far. So even doing this thing week over week in proud, you know, taking pride in what did you do? Well, this week, right? And if let's just say you're raising capital, then you could look at it and be like, okay, I did one call. We goes one call, we go as one call, now you look at it and be like, well, I've been doing one call a week, I really want to raise million dollars, this doesn't align, I really need to change something, right? Or it could be something about if your goal is finding deals, you could be, you know, measure those things. And you could see, okay, I talked to five brokers or agents, because a lot of times you're too busy doing the work. So imagine we are chopping wood in the forest. we're so busy chopping, we never sit down to really ask is my technique good? You know, is my axe sharp enough? We are just like, Hey, man, I don't have time I'm running. So chop, chop, chop, instead of that sit down for that hour really, really reflect ask, you know, who could support me in that market? Do I know someone? How can I leverage my time, whether it's hiring a VA or whatnot? How can I change the way I do things? Can I put two hours in the morning to do these tests, all sorts of ideas will come up, I might take a little while but this is the best hour you could invest in yourself as a real estate investor. So that's a great answer. That would be you know, highly, highly actionable step. The second thing would be figuring out you know, what's going on with the fear limiting belief and we all have it a certain point, right? It's just getting some clarity around it. If I'm really really fearful of Hey, you know what, I don't want to do this because I'm afraid I might not get enough time to spend with my family because I already have a full time job right? So what what is that specific fear a limiting belief and once we have it, we could start challenging it. So getting clarity on that helps. Another important that third important thing is really paying attention to the strategy. We all have different skill sets. We have different goals. So how do we create a strategy that just works best for us? So first, that someone that starting a flipping might be great answer for them, and they could just flip and flip and flip and build wealth for someone like yourself or me, maybe not. I'm not handy, I'm not interested. So rather than thinking because you could make money in all facets of real estate, figuring out what is my game plan? What is the strategy? And does that align with my interest in developing the skills and things like that, right, instead of just doing some transactions, which is okay, in the beginning, in making some money, it's just like, Okay, do Is it better for me to partner, you know, I think like, I that could work well, somebody could raise capital or find deals for me, and I could do this. And I think I could be accountable that way. And I know the pie smaller, but eventually, it's just going to go bigger. So focusing on strategy, the reflection piece, and then the mindset, the limiting belief, fear, those are some things that will, you know, help you accelerate wherever you're trying to go.

Ardijan Hasandzekaj 31:04

So, thank you for that. So that's actually a great answer. You know, from, from my perspective, starting off here, you know, like, I, when I met Brian, we talked about my experience, you know, I've started off with some duplexes, and, you know, I ended up basically managing them myself, you know, they're profitable, it was enjoyable, in a sense that I did learn new skills, and it can expose me to things, but ultimately, it was kind of having another job. And so that's not really what I was looking for. And, you know, one of the big realisations that I've had was that, you know, you you need partner, so you gotta, you have to find a partner to allow you to, you know, like I said, gain traction and increase the velocity of your trajectory. And so for me, I still have not found the right partner. And again, I've just started exploring this arena in the past less than a year, what what would be your recommendations on finding a partner? Or what are the things that you would look at? that somebody that could have propelled you to achieve your goals faster than you already did? Or do you think you did everything the way you would want to? Yeah, so

Ketan Patel 32:13

you know, my value was more around the capital side, because that particular partner, they have already figured out where to buy what to do that machine, all they needed was capital, Investor Relations, and figuring that out. So that was my piece. And also bringing that transparency, so to speak, in having clarity on roles and what's supposed to happen, there wasn't any confusion on you know, what I'm going to do what they're going to end to Brian's point, which is excellent, how do we be attractive partner to right, so just kind of being very good with communication. So the potential partner could see that we just have somewhat of a vision and a plan. And it's not that we are just willy nilly trying to figure it all out. So for me, the value was bringing the capital, so to speak, kind of making sure I was conservative and looking out for my partner that if I said, I'll bring 500, I'll make sure I get it done, I could bring 800, but I'll be conservative, so they knew that they could trust on me, when I say I'm gonna bring in X number, and I'll follow with their protocols and things and whatever that is, in going back hindsight, a lot of the things I'm talking about, I didn't knew I didn't put a lot of attention to strategy. Right. So I was looking at a little bit of this little bit of that. So in hindsight, if I had been more strategic, who would have helped, if I had worked more on my mindset, and limiting beliefs, all that stuff would have held to a little faster.

Brian Briscoe 33:42

Yeah. And I'll, I'll give you my, my experience, you know, I was in a coaching programme, and the four Oaks, you know, we we came together around one deal. And I think the value that I brought, I got the deal under contract. So that was something that I brought to the table. But I also had a coach at the time, you know, we all four of us, none of us had extensive multi family. You know, between the four of us, we had probably owned, you know, 50 different single family rentals and some small multifamily and had LP done deals, but none of us had been the sponsor or the operator. And, you know, for me, it was bringing a deal to the table, and then just having, you know, the coach behind my back that could, you know, guide me and direct me, you know, being the brand new guy, you know, among for new guys, but that that was the value I brought. And, quite frankly, I realised that the partners that I chose were all, you know, really good people. And that just made me want to hustle even more to try to keep them. That makes sense.

Ardijan Hasandzekaj 34:44

Yeah, and I did hear your story, you know, at the conference as well, Brian and and I think, you know, it didn't bring valid point. I mean, you have to, you know, be in a partnership with people that you trust that you think are good people and they're you know, they're They're going to be there for you. Now, if you don't mind me asking you, Brian, like, you do think that the fact that you had a coach or you're part of this, you know, group helped you land your first deal could have been done it on your own, if you had the same mindset.

Brian Briscoe 35:21

I think having the coach helped me to have the confidence that I didn't have in myself. You know, I think going into this, I had a lot of limiting beliefs. And I think just having the coach helped me to gain that confidence. I just did have, you know, so more and more than anything, I think that coaching helped me just to unlock my potential, you know, it wasn't, you know, wasn't anything they said? Or did that made a huge difference, it was mostly realising that I can do this. And that's, that's more than anything else that helped me get that first deal. It wasn't the coach telling me what to do and help me to underwrite properties. It was more of me thinking, using the coaches, my safety net, saying I can go big, because I got him in my corner type stuff. And it was it was just that self confidence that I got from that. More than anything else.

Ardijan Hasandzekaj 36:15

Yeah, yeah. I mean, you know, when I call brokers, it's a process. And I think, you know, initially when I spoke to them, you know, like, at the beginning, they could tell I've completely new and, yeah, now it's, it's a little bit more, you know, you know, I'm a little bit more confident than I think I'm more experienced, because I've done it. And I also have, you know, I'm also doing personal coaching, which which is, is helped tremendously. I mean, I think coaching is an aspect that a lot of people don't realise that it's, you know, it can really propel you much faster than you would otherwise. So, yeah,

Brian Briscoe 36:53

I think that's true. Most people who are, you know, extremely successful and anything all have a coach. Yeah, exactly.

Ketan Patel 37:01

Absolutely. And to add into your guys point, similar situation as well, right? If I hadn't had a coach push me, I might not have looked at the other avenues, because it's much easier to self rationalise, and think this is not in my reach, or this is not the right move or whatever, versus somebody that's outside of you. They could look at your talents or things and they could stretch you and they don't have to be afraid, they could just tell you, Hey, where are you shortchanging yourself here and then believing in yourself? And you have someone to answer to does something to And naturally, if someone has experience and they have travelled a lane, they'll have some wisdom for you that you could use to, you know, chart your path. So absolutely. My coaches and mentors have helped me tremendously to get results on myself as well.

Brian Briscoe 37:51

I remember a big conference. And this was 2018, the first big conference I went to, you know, I showed up with a lot of limiting beliefs. One thing that helped me is a guy put it literally put his hand on my shoulder, we were in the corner of the big networking area. And he just did one of these things where he pointed across the room, he says, Look at all those people. He's like, Brian, and none of those guys are any better or any worse than you are. And a lot of them are doing what you want to do. And now that was one of the things that just kind of unlocked it to my, in my mind, it was just like, you know what, you're right. You know, we're in a room with a bunch of just normal people, they'll look normal, they'll dress normal, they'll drive normal cars. And some of these guys are buying 234 100 unit properties. Maybe I can do it too.

Ardijan Hasandzekaj 38:38

Yeah, no Kitani, and you probably understand what I'm saying, in a sense that, you know, when I was when I came here to the States, and you know, when I was in high school, I started calling and I would tell people that I wanted to become a doctor. And you know, I would hear it all the time. And I'd be like, Oh, you know, it's very tough. Even people that live here can do this. And that and, and I just, you know, I just realised, I mean, like these other people, it's not, there's nothing special about becoming something is just, you know, it's the effort, discipline, having the vision, and just having that grit and pushing forward. And I had the same thing without conference where we met Brian, I mean, you know, I, I met so many amazing people and on everybody. And I would purposely ask everybody story, including yours. And you know, and you hear this, it's, it's a story of grit. That's what it is, is nothing to do with being better than others being, you know, luckier than others is nothing to do with any of that stuff. So yeah.

Brian Briscoe 39:36

I just looked at the time and realise that wow, we we've, we're pretty much out of time. We've talked for a long time. I Oh, my goodness, but absolutely love this conversation. And one question for both of you before you as we as we wrap things up, Keaton go first, how can listeners learn more about you? Yeah, so

Ketan Patel 39:55

you know, I'm on YouTube, LinkedIn, my website, Katyn Patel KETANP ATL, but if you're someone that seems like you want to get to your goals, but you have a limiting belief, fear, a strategic question, happy to do a discovery session with you, all you have to do is hit the take action button, fill out a form and we'll talk on the phone call in I have a bunch of resources on raising capital and managing productivity and all that on my website videos and things for you guys. So

Brian Briscoe 40:26

Alright, we'll have a link to that in the show notes. Definitely, if you're interested, check it out. And already same question for you. how can listeners learn more?

Ardijan Hasandzekaj 40:34

All right, well, first of all, thank you for having me on your podcast. Brian, this was my first official podcast. Thank you so much. I am looking forward to returning to a podcast being on the other seat.

Brian Briscoe 40:44

Absolutely. Love it.

Ardijan Hasandzekaj 40:46

Yeah, absolutely. Yes. Yes. Yes. And, you know, if anybody wants to get a hold of me, you know, be best to my email. It's AR d Yeah, that's what it

Brian Briscoe 41:00

right, super simple. And we'll put a link we'll put your email address in the show notes as well. That said, guys, thank you so so much. I very much enjoyed the conversation, you know, so much that we almost spilled over time by quite a bit. But thank you again for coming on.

Thank you for listening to the divergent apartment investor podcast today brought to you by four oaks capital. If you'd like to know more about how to invest in apartment buildings or want to be a guest on our show, visit our website at four oaks slash podcasts, or email us directly. If you're still listening, you obviously like the show. So pull out your phone, app, subscribe, and leave us a five star rating on your favourite podcast app. And we'll see you again next week.

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