First Deal Episode with Savannah Arroyo

Episode 110 of the Diary of an Apartment Investor Podcast with Savannah Arroyo, hosted by Brian Briscoe. Transcript by – please forgive any errors.

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Brian Briscoe 0:00

What advice would you give an aspiring investor that's, you know, maybe six to 12 months behind you,

Savannah Arroyo 0:05

I would say to reach out there and start connecting with people who are doing what you want to be doing if there was a specific part of the business, when even when I started getting into marketing and marketing, I looked at people whose marketing out there I loved and reached out to them and I'm like, how did you do this? How do you build your brand I want to learn more. When you're looking in specific areas. If you're looking in the market, even it might seem competitive. But if you're working with someone who's a couple steps ahead of you, most of the time, they'll share knowledge and give you feedback. So if you're looking to get started don't really know where to start. start connecting with people who are at where you want to be.

Brian Briscoe 0:47

Welcome to the diaries and apartment investor podcast with your host Brian Briscoe. In this podcast, we bring some of the top professionals in the apartment investment field to discuss various aspects of the apartment investing journey, with the sole purpose of educating listeners to make wise investment decisions. The Diary of an apartment investor podcast is sponsored by four oaks capital, bringing you high yield returns through apartment complex investing. This is episode number 110 and part of our first deal series. Today we talked about Savannah Arroyo, also known as the net worth nurse who recently closed on a 12 unit apartment complex in North Bend, Oregon. And now, the show Welcome to the diary apartment investor podcast. I'm your host Brian brisco with four oaks capital. I'm super excited for today's show. It's one of our new series, the first deal series episodes, and we have Savannah Arroyo, who recently closed on a 12 unit apartment complex in North Bend, Oregon. So just tell you a little bit about her. She is the network nurse. She's a full time registered nurse in Los Angeles, California. And she uses her skills as a leader in health care operations to manage multifamily syndications. She also helps busy medical professionals create passive income through real estate investing. So that said, Savannah, welcome to the show. Hi, thank you. I'm super stoked to be here. Yeah, this is fun. I really appreciate your time. And yeah, I'm excited to talk about your story here. Let's do this. Let's talk about you for a second. Let's talk about your background and history and basically bring us up to how you made the decision to get into multifamily.

Savannah Arroyo 2:21

Yes. So I grew up in Northern California. I went to college in Sacramento State University. I got my nursing degree, I worked in a couple of different nursing specialties, went back to school and got my master's degree in nursing leadership and administration. And then I moved down to Los Angeles i right now I oversee a multiple departments at a hospital down here in LA. It was when I was on maternity leave with my second daughter that my husband and I started looking at different investment strategies, ways that we could make our money work for us. We stumbled upon real estate started buying single family homes and then shortly after, we quickly switched into multifamily, specifically syndications. And right now we're doing value add multifamily syndications. Right.

Brian Briscoe 3:05

So let's talk a little bit about the single family homes. I think that's where most people who want to get into real estate start. So why single family? And then tell us about I mean, you live in Los Angeles, where were you actually investing?

Savannah Arroyo 3:16

Yes. So single family just think because it's one of the more traditional ways of doing it, you're kind of doing it by yourself. You're finding your lender, finding a house kind of rolling through the motions, we own our primary residence. So we've been there done that, we felt that it was a pretty easy jump into real estate investment. We do live in Los Angeles, the price point to entry is very high hair. So we started looking at different markets. We fell in love with the Atlanta Georgia market for a lot of different reasons and started developing relationships out there with brokers sending us deals, and we ended up buying two new build townhomes over there. Pretty easy to jump into real estate, not a lot of issues with that it was a build to ramp projects. So they have property management already in place that tenants place before it was even being done built. So it was a pretty easy way to jump in. But then after we did those deals, we were wanting more. We wanted to keep doing deals and then that's when we switched into multifamily

Brian Briscoe 4:11

right now just just out of curiosity. So what you said it sounds like it was a turnkey operator. Yes. Okay, exactly. And why do you pick Georgia? Did you pick a turnkey operator and they were operating in Georgia? Do you say I want to look in Georgia because I love Georgia?

Savannah Arroyo 4:23

Yeah, we were looking in Georgia, we were actually looking to do the bur method across the country, which if anyone doesn't know it's buying a place rehabbing it, or renovating it putting a renter in it to start collecting that rental income, refinancing and repeat to kind of just accumulate rental properties. That was our plan. And then when it came down to overseeing a complete rehab on a property with all of our capital invested into it, we just realised that was completely out of our comfort zone and we didn't really want to move forward with that. And we started researching the market the film industry and the entertainment industry is huge over there. We hear it in LA a lot of our friends encircles we're talking about moving over to Georgia filming in Georgia. And as I started researching it, Marvel moved over there, Tyler Perry, Dwayne Johnson, all these studios are moving over there. They are investigating the city, there's a lot of growth, the city has a lot of plans to just kind of renovate the city and push out a lot of new things. So a lot of different reasons. But those were kind of some of the main ones.

Brian Briscoe 5:21

Okay, interesting. Interesting. Yeah. And I focus on that, because I think a lot of people I do the same thing. Okay, I started out with single family homes a little bit different than you did. I'm active duty military. So I move every two to three years. So I'd buy a house live in it for a minute or two seemed like a minute or two and rented when we moved out. But you know, same same as you I started thinking single family homes, because it's something I can, I can understand, I can understand buying a single family home. So so you, you said you looked into multifamily homes to be able to scale and be able to basically do the same thing at a higher level. Before we talk specifically about multifamily. I want to dive into what I call the big burning. Why? You know what motivates you to do this? You mentioned a little bit before, but if you can just distil it down? Why are you motivated to do this?

Savannah Arroyo 6:12

Yes. And the Y was huge for us. That was when after we bought those single family homes and realised we wanted to switch into multifamily. We read an amazing book, financial freedom through real estate investing by Michael Blanc. And that was when we were really able to see that we could scale this and become financially free through real estate. And we sat down, put down our goals of where we want to be in five years where we want to be in three years and what we need to be doing on a yearly basis, a monthly basis to get to those goals. And when we did it that way and kind of backtracked with where we want to be. The Blueprint was really laid out to us and what steps we needed to be taking.

Brian Briscoe 6:48

Nice, nice, I love it to be able to be able to put your goal on paper and backwards plan. And incidentally, I'm speaking at an event A little later today. And that's that's exactly what I'm talking about is putting putting your goals on paper backwards plan and then do your daily whatever you need to do your daily actions to get there. So So you decided to go from single family to multifamily. And for some people doesn't seem like a big jump, but it kinda is, you know, what did you guys do to prepare yourself to jump into the multifamily realm?

Savannah Arroyo 7:17

We started networking and that was the biggest thing we signed up for a mentorship coaching programme for us, we were working full time jobs. We have two young children at home, I have a one year old and a three year old. We wanted and we were planning to be working with other people's money at this point, we had told friends and family we were investing in real estate people expressed interest they were interested in joining and our next deal. And when we realised we would be handling other people's money, that's when we decided, hey, we're going to sign up for a mentorship coaching programme just to make sure we're dotting our eyes crossing our T's having that extra set of eyes looking over our shoulder at our deals that are underwriting going through the legal process with us that was very important to us. And it gave us the confidence to take that first step. So that was one of the big things that we utilised. Moving forward another thing was really just networking with people that are doing it. We started this during the COVID pandemic. So virtuals zoom meetings and online masterminds were they were everywhere. So we were jumping on those networking with other people doing it and just kind of getting feedback and collaborating with other investors.

Brian Briscoe 8:22

Yeah, yeah, I think that's huge that you, you did a lot of things that I think most people try to do. And I do want to ask one more question about networking. Would you recommend other people get a mentor or maybe maybe even ask a better question? At what point would you recommend somebody else, get a mentor?

Savannah Arroyo 8:41

I think this is different for everyone. And for us. We were so motivated, we had our goals listed down, we were ready to take action. And if you don't have the time to be there and start taking action, maybe that's not the right time. But another thing that I learned even after joining the mentorship programme and diving into the community of multifamily investors is there so many people out there that are willing to provide their assistance, their feedback, their their kind of support as you're working through those deals? I mean, I'm definitely one of them. When people reach out to me and they're kind of asking how I did it, or what tips I have, I'm more than happy to set up calls with people I love giving back and there's so many people in the community entrepreneur, ship mindset and just really wanting to give back. So if you're wanting that just maybe not as extensively as a coaching programme because they are expensive, and they are a lot a big time constraint really because you want to be invested in it. So if you're wanting to kind of just take maybe baby steps into it, I would dive into the networking group and kind of rub shoulders with people who are already doing it.

Brian Briscoe 9:46

You want one thing that I found you know, I also did mention mentorship as well but for me, I think it accelerated a lot of stuff. And I think a lot of people find that out. Yes, you can do it by yourself. You can go baby steps you can get into you Get into everything and do the exact same thing that other syndicators are doing without mentorship. But I think it definitely helps out. So let's talk about the team. Alright, did you you had together, I talked about three things a lot, you know, what you need to do to be successful. And it's building a team raising capital and finding deals. And I think if you can do those three things you're going to do okay, so we'll get them one at a time. They're interrelated. Let's talk about the team you guys had.

Savannah Arroyo 10:27

Yeah, building a broker who's getting your your deals, vetting out a relationship with the property management team who's going to be overseeing your business plan, especially for us, we're investing out of state. So this relationship is honestly one of the most important ones we're doing heavy value add to our properties, either increasing rents doing some renovations. So it's very important to us to work with a property management team who has a lot of experience doing that, who's very familiar with the market can give you feedback, when they're we're showing them are underwriting and saying, Hey, we plan to raise the rents by this much every year for the next three to five years. What like is this feasible and a good property management who's very knowledgeable in the market should be able to give you very honest, thorough, direct feedback on your numbers and whether they'll work or not. And just really having that knowledge in the market, because we're investing now to state the boots on the ground. That relationships so important. And so how we do that is and even all the relationships on our team, we look up a few different people, maybe a handful of people, we have our standard interview questions that we ask them things that we need to take into consideration for our specific deals, we interview them. And then even if we have two qualified candidates who are pretty much same experience, same knowledge level, at that point, we really decide on our personality, because they are a part of our team, we're going to be working closely with them for the next five years, depending on how long the investment is. And so at that point, it's important for your personalities to mesh because you're having very constant communication with them. And that plays a huge factor and your your relationship.

Brian Briscoe 11:57

Yeah, you have to get along. I mean, that's, that's First of all, and I think, I think you're absolutely right, if if all the things are equal, I think experience, just like you said, experience is important. all other things being equal, you go with the person that you like, better to, and that's going to make things a lot smoother along the way. Alright, so property manager, integral part of the team, I, you know, 100% agree with, with what you said there, let's talk about finding the deal. And, you know, specifically, one thing that a lot of people have problems with is the broker, you know, and not not necessarily problems with the broker, but problems getting the broker to give you time. So let's, let's talk a little bit about how you found the deal and how basically built that relationship with the broker.

Savannah Arroyo 12:37

So the broker that that amount of the number game with that one was a lot higher. So we talked to a lot of brokers before we established a really good relationship with one and I think it is hard when you're diving into the space, the multifamily syndications or multifamily space from single family homes and you're doing your first deal, it's hard for people to take you seriously. So we did our homework. And we got very specific on the deals that we were looking at. So for each specific market, we were looking at a different unit set price point, price per unit, a different kind of strategy, depending on the market or sub market. And we made sure that we were very knowledgeable on the market, we've never been a GA, but I could tell you all the subsidies over there, which ones are good, which ones are experiencing turnover. And that's because I was diving into different I mean, looking at the prices on Zillow walking the street streets on Google streets and just knowing the market. So that's huge. Knowing the market if you're investing out of state, and then getting specific on your unit mix, I mean, so when we were looking in Oregon, we were looking for 12 to 25 units, one to 2 million price point entry, where we had a specific amount of capital that we had in our mind that we were looking to raise. And then so we were very specific on our strategy. And maybe it took us a little bit longer to find the deal because the brokers not sending us all the deals at this point. But then by the time they sent us one want a deal that met those criteria, we were able to take action very quickly. And another thing is we gave feedback very quickly to the brokers as well, they're dealing with a lot of different investors, and they're sending out deals not getting a lot of feedback. So if you can provide feedback within 48 hours on their deal, even if it doesn't fit and just let them know, Hey, I can't make my numbers work with this one. It's a little too high price entry or the value adds a little bit too much. I'm not looking to do that much. Just some sort of feedback like one or two sentences and then Hey, keep that deal that deal flow coming in or I'm looking forward to the next deal that goes such a long way.

Brian Briscoe 14:30

I think is huge. I think that really is because it shows that number one you're you're actually taking action on what they send out and establish brokers, I mean, the list of people that they're sending these deals to, you know, hundreds and sometimes 1000s of people. So if you're one of the few that responds every single time it's it's the squeaky wheel gets the grease all over again, you know, so and it really really helps establish that relationship. You know, they they look at you as a contender instead of a tire kicker. You know They begin to look at you as a contender instead of a tire kicker. You know if you're giving good solid feedback every time like that, that's exactly what happens. That's that's the best way in my opinion to get in with with brokers like that. So good Anya now, North Bend. Alright, let's let's talk about North Bend. How far from a major city is that? About an hour? hour from Portland? Right?

Savannah Arroyo 15:25

Well, no, a few hours from Portland, probably an hour from Roseburg, which is probably the next biggest city and then maybe an hour and a half from Eugene.

Brian Briscoe 15:32

Okay. So why did you choose North Bend, Oregon.

Savannah Arroyo 15:36

My parents live in Oregon, when we first started looking at properties really more out of curiosity than anything, we were just looking at different markets, I was looking at Sacramento because that's where I'm from just looking at what deals looked like there. It gives you a better perception of when you're looking in a market, just kind of how things are in different markets and across the country. It's good to look at and compare different markets. We were looking up there out of curiosity, found some strong value ideals, just started reaching out to brokers to get some numbers on them. So we could do some of the underwriting. And then we started finding good deals and developed a good relationship with a broker. And it was really just kind of an organic thing that happened.

Brian Briscoe 16:13

So So you started looking in Oregon, you mentioned your parents living there. And I think that's smart. I think that's really smart. Because you have a reason to go up there anyway. You know, and you have a competitive advantage because you have family in the area. And you probably know that the markets a little better than I would for example, you know, I've been to Portland, I've been to Oregon once. You know, it's been two days there. So good. So you you pick that area, if I'm not mistaken, because your parents were there you started looking at stuff. And things look good. And you hit paydirt. Yes. All right. So we talked about building, the team talked about raising the money, excuse me finding the deal. Now let's talk about the money.

Savannah Arroyo 16:53

Yes. So like I mentioned, we had some friends and family who are interested just because when you start doing real estate, that's kind of all you talk about. And so it naturally come up in relation to different conversations that we had with people and it's shocking how much interest people have in real estate and they just don't really know a lot about it. Just have follow up questions, especially with the syndications and appealing to passive investors, people don't realise how easy it is to invest in something like that reap the rewards of investing in real estate without doing a lot of the heavy lifting. So real estate syndications, working with a lot of other medical professionals, it was this huge opportunity for us to be able to offer that real estate, that investment strategy to people who wouldn't normally know about it or do it. And that was a huge opportunity for us.

Brian Briscoe 17:40

Nice, nice. So you think what you told me earlier, we had to raise what a quarter 1,250,000 for this one?

Savannah Arroyo 17:47

Yes. So 250,000 raise for this one. We had friends and family investing with us, a nurse that I worked with. And we were kind of working through the conversations learning kind of the same way, at the same time as them with some of the questions. But that's so important that even when they would have questions for us that we wouldn't necessarily be able to answer right away, we'd be we would just keep the communication very open and transparent and say, Hey, I don't know. But I'm going to get back to you if it was like a certain tax question or something like that. It was something that we were just very transparent with all our numbers with our communication. And that goes a long way in building those relationships.

Brian Briscoe 18:26

So what was what would you say was the most frequent question you got from you know, the friends and family that you were trying to get into to invest with you,

Savannah Arroyo 18:35

probably when they start getting their mailbox money when they start getting paid. So depending on your strategy and your investment, I mean, if it's a very strong value, I deal they're probably not going to get cash for a while six to six months to a year while you stabilise the asset. So having that conversation on the front end is very important. But if you're going over the underwriting and kind of the business plan of the property, it should be very well known that that's kind of just what's going on with the deal.

Brian Briscoe 19:00

Okay, nice. Nice. Alright, so let's let's talk about getting the deal closed. All right. So you found the deal, you raised some money, you had your team in place, tell us about the process of getting the deal closed, and especially go over hangups that you guys had, I think every every deal that I've seen, there's always something that comes up, that's a challenge you have to overcome.

Savannah Arroyo 19:20

It's a lot of moving pieces. So this is where I really leverage my skill set at my w two job. I oversee operations for multiple departments. I'm used to putting out fires all day, every day. That's pretty much what I do at work and kind of organising things for process improvement, working on a few things at once. And with a syndication, you're dealing with financing, you're raising the money from investors, you're making sure your lender has all the paperwork they need. That's a huge part of the process. They're constantly coming back to you asking for more paperwork, more financial statements, and you need to get back to them in a very timely manner. Because that's honestly the longest part of the process and that was maybe one of the biggest hang ups. We had was With our lender, some just certain things came up where we were working with a local credit union, we were syndicating out the deal. And although we made that very well known to them from the beginning, at the final closing date, they laid on us like, Hey, we need 51% ownership from people signing on the loan. And that was kind of a shock to us. We weren't really planning for that. But because my husband and I were investing so much in the deal, it was a very strong deal. And we wanted to reap some of those benefits. And so we were investing so much. And then we had a guarantor on our loan anyways, to meet the network liquidity requirements, one of our investors signed on the loan with us. And then we gave them a portion of the GP to compensate them for that. And we were able to meet the over 51%. But that was something that almost prevented it from closing, it happened at the last minute, and we weren't necessarily prepared for it. But instead of getting super frustrated, like oh, my God, that deal is not going to work. It's over. We were just like, Okay, what do we need to do to make it work? And having that attitude and being adaptable to change is so huge in the business?

Brian Briscoe 20:58

Yeah, we've actually done something similar on one of the deals that we were closing quite a while ago, actually. But we brought one of our investors into the GP just to help with with a lot. I mean, there's always a lot of things, you know, there's there's liquidity their skin in the game, but there's a lot of things that the banks or credit unions or whoever you're dealing with want to see. And not all loans are created equal. So sometimes you can't perceive things. But yeah, we did the exact same thing brought one of our investors into the GP, had him sign on the loan to leverage a couple of things that, you know, he brought to the table, that we didn't buy ourselves. So smart move. And I think it's something that a lot of people would benefit from hearing just because it's an option out there.

Savannah Arroyo 21:39

Yeah. And one more thing I want to touch on about that is, when you're getting into the space and a newbie, and you're trying to do your first indication, you may think like, I don't know anyone like this, I don't know anyone who needs to network liquidity requirements. But as you start networking and diving into different masterminds and groups, like I'm on a mastermind call every week, and I will hopped on the call expecting everyone on here is going to be a GP operator wanting to raise money, they're doing the same thing I'm doing. And as I got on the call, I'm like there's LPs on the call that are betting on operators. There's key principals who are willing to sign on loans for different operators just hanging on the call trying to vet out different operators, there's so many people that are willing to make the deal work, because it's a mutually beneficial relationship, you're helping out the Kp, they're signing on the loan, not doing any of the work. They're just trusting you as an operator, and they're getting some of the rewards. So a lot of the relationships within syndications are mutually beneficial. And that's what I love about it.

Brian Briscoe 22:32

I think a lot of people realise it's not a zero sum game, you know, partnership is going to get you further in this game than competition in a lot of cases. Yeah, I mean, obviously, there's times where you are directly competing with their people. But there's, there's enough fish in the sea. There's enough apartments out there that a lot of people are willing to come in as you know, key principles to lend their experience lend their balance sheet, you lend their their liquidity to be able to get a deal across the finish line. I mean, obviously, you have to pay for it by typically getting a percentage of the GP or some KPI is watched for a point or two. And there it goes. So we talked about getting close any any other big hurdles trying to get a closed.

Savannah Arroyo 23:13

I've really just, I guess the time constraint that it took to do that first deal. And my husband and I were doing it together, we were learning, we wanted to learn all aspects of the business. So we were really doing every portion of that deal side by side. And now after we've done that deal, and we're doing more deals, we've split up different parts of our business, which has been a lot easier to get things done. But it was very important to us to learn every piece of that we were on every investor call together, we were talking to the lawyer together and just so we could have a better understanding of it.

Brian Briscoe 23:41

Yeah, I think that's huge. I think having a good understanding of the process from beginning to end, no matter what role you play in a company in a syndication or in a GP, having a good idea of the entire process from beginning to end is something every player needs to have. You know, I think it'll make you a better a better teammate in a lot of ways. So I think it was a strong move on that part. You and your husband have both been through from A to Z one syndication. And now as you divide up roles, you have a really good understanding on what the other person needs and what the other person can provide to you so good on that one. Alright, so let's talk about the first steps after close remind me When did you close on this one? Back in November 2020. Okay, so it's March right now so doing pulling out my fingers that's four months so let's let's talk about you know, the first steps after closing and where you guys are now,

Savannah Arroyo 24:33

huh? So getting the working with the property management I mean, they you if you're working with someone who has lots of experience they get over get the new leases signs we were are because it was so below market value rents. We were increasing rents right off the bat 8.1% for the tenants and we had no issues with that even during COVID we've had no delinquencies on the building, which is huge for us rolling over different parts of the park to property management and then in this building, we had to sell unit that were converted into a studio unit. So working with our contractor to get that cleared out pulling permits for the city to get the approval for that working with an engineer to get the sketches out, really kind of that constant communication of getting the ball rolling, making sure people are kind of on par with our business plan.

Brian Briscoe 25:17

All right, good. Good. And next question. You know what's next for you

Savannah Arroyo 25:22

keep doing deals value on multifamily syndications, we are so juiced with the community, we're building a lot of different relationships, I launched the net worth nurse a few months ago and just building content for that connecting with other investors. It's provided me kind of a platform where now I can easily connect with investors who want to learn more about real estate investing and to provide the content to them. And really just moving forward with that part of our business.

Brian Briscoe 25:51

Yeah, and I'm chuckling a little bit on the inside because I think we talked to once and then I saw you on Instagram as a net worth nurse and I didn't put the two together. And I remember reaching out to you on Instagram and saying, Hey, you know, I see what you're doing. I really like it. And you're like, yeah, we talked last week. Oh, gosh, you know,

Savannah Arroyo 26:11

it's so I was at a convention last weekend in Texas, a multifamily convention. I'm talking to people connecting with people. My badge says Savannah Royale. Right. And then I come back this week, and I start posting pictures. And people are like, Oh, you're the networth nerd. Yeah, maybe I need to go everywhere in scrubs or something. Yeah, maybe people make that connection. But yeah, it's uh,

Brian Briscoe 26:33

Savannah. The net worth nurse, you know. Anyway, I felt like a schmuck for about a half a second. And I was just like, all right, okay, you got me. But Alright, so good. So here, here's my favourite question of the whole thing. What advice would you give an aspiring investor that's, you know, maybe six to 12 months behind you,

Savannah Arroyo 26:50

I would say to reach out there and start connecting with people who are doing what you want to be doing. If there was a specific part of the business. When even when I started getting into marketing and marketing, I looked at people whose marketing out there I loved and reached out to them. And I'm like, how did you do this? How do you build your brand, I want to learn more. When you're looking in specific areas, if you're looking in the market, even it might seem competitive. But if you're working with someone who's a couple steps ahead of you, most of the time, they'll share knowledge and give you feedback. So if you're looking to get started, don't really know where to start, start connecting with people who are at where you want to be.

Brian Briscoe 27:23

I agree. 100%. And I know you mentioned before that you're willing to talk to people so so let's let's hit that. First, how can listeners learn more about you or potentially get in touch with you?

Savannah Arroyo 27:33

Yes, the net worth nurse so you can find me under the net worth nurse on all social media handles that's Facebook, LinkedIn, YouTube, and Instagram. It's also my website. My email is Savannah at the net worth nurse and I love connecting with people. So even if you're remotely interested in anything I've been saying, reach out to me I love I would love to chat.

Brian Briscoe 27:52

Absolutely follow her give her a ring or whatever you got to do to get in contact if you're interested in what she's talking about, or has to say. And that said, you know, Savannah, thank you. Thank you so, so much for coming on the show today. I really appreciate your time. Yeah, no, it's been my pleasure.

Thank you for listening to the diary of an apartment investor podcast today brought to you by four oaks capital. If you'd like to know more about how to invest in apartment buildings or want to be a guest on our show, visit our website at four oaks capital comm slash podcast or email us directly. If you're still listening, you obviously like the show. So pull out your phone, tap subscribe, and leave us a five star rating on your favourite podcast app. And we'll see you again next week.

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