Finding Contractors with Chelsea Garber and Kimberly McCall

Updated: May 22




Episode 137 of the Diary of an Apartment Investor Podcast with Chelsea Garber and Kimberly McCall, hosted by Brian Briscoe. Transcript by Otter.ai – please forgive any errors.


Listen to the episode here





Brian Briscoe 00:00

You know, Kim, we got Chelsea here. What do you what do you want to ask her?


Kimberly McCall 00:02

How do you find your contractors


Chelsea Garber 00:04

for the design projects most of the contractors are already in place with the property owners and they've engaged with them and these types of investors have worked on not to say it's not their you know, 100 deal but they've done many multifamily deals in the markets that they're working in. So they have their teams lined up. So we're, you know, we'll be a resource if we let's say, in Oklahoma, we're working on projects and you know, now I know contacts there, I'll share it with other investors that are working on projects and like, just like in any business, right, if, if they're a good reputable person, but word of mouth.


Brian Briscoe 00:47

Welcome to the diary of an apartment investor podcast with your host Brian Briscoe. In this podcast we bring some of the top professionals in the apartment investment field to discuss various aspects of the apartment investing journey, with the sole purpose of educating listeners to make wise investment decisions. The Diary of an apartment investor podcast is sponsored by four oaks capital, bringing you high yield returns through apartment complex investing. Welcome to the diamond apartment investor podcast. I'm your host Brian Briscoe with fairoaks capital and very excited for today's show. It's one of our Ask the Expert episodes. We have two amazing women on the line with us right now we have Chelsea Garber and Kimberly McCall. So first, we introduce the the more experienced investor out of the two and Chelsea. Glad to have you on the show. Welcome.


Chelsea Garber 01:32

Brian. Happy to be here.


Brian Briscoe 01:34

Yeah,


Brian Briscoe 01:35

it's long time in the making. So you know, we were talking just before the show we met about two years ago. And it's been a been a lot, a lot of fun track. Excuse me, been a lot of fun following you and and seeing what you guys been doing. So yeah, welcome.


Chelsea Garber 01:50

Yeah, no. And likewise, we, we were going I was going into Michael Long's program, I think as you were coming out, yeah. And it's been absolutely incredible. I remember sitting next to you at his event two summers ago in Dallas, and you were just kind of like on the brink of your first deal. And yeah, I was just all jazzed. watching what's happening between now and then has really just been astounding. So have hats off to you.


Brian Briscoe 02:15

Thanks. Yeah, that that was that was a lot of fun. I use events, and you come out with just a ton of energy, and you're just ready to go. And the hard part's always, you know, sustaining that afterwards. But yeah, that that was we had our first deal under contract, and we went there, and we closed on that one, like a month or two afterwards. And it's just been just been a fun ride ever since. So. But yeah, I think actually, I know that the same event, dealmaker live is going to be live in Dallas again in July. So actual people in the same room as each other again,


02:53

amazing.


Chelsea Garber 02:54

Yeah, don't quote me. But I think it's July 15 to 17th. It's a Thursday through Saturday, or 17th to 19th we're gonna look at the calendar. But yeah. Are you planning on being there? Are you gonna be myths of moving,


Brian Briscoe 03:07

I will be there. And my partner and I are speaking on the Friday evening. So 15th through 17th is the dates and Eric and I are going to be on stage on the 16th the Friday evening.


Chelsea Garber 03:19

So I'll be there cheering you on. Yeah,


Brian Briscoe 03:22

so it's gonna be fun. It's gonna be a great event. And just so everybody who's listening go to go to microbox event. It's gonna be fun. You know, you meet Chelsea, you can meet me and you know, we'll we'll have a good time. But that's Chelsea. Well, let's talk about you. Give us a give us an idea of who you are, where you come from. Tell us about your background, and just kind of lead us up to how you got into multifamily.


Chelsea Garber 03:44

Yeah, definitely. So Chelsea Garber, born and raised in New York, just outside of Manhattan, spent most of my adult life and career in New York City was trained, actually, my professional background is in both interior design and construction. So worked for some of the top design firms in the country and in New York and went on to start my own design firms. So focused largely and high end residential and you know, home people with two or three homes and penthouses in the city have big house in the Hamptons, ranch out west, you name it, and it was just a great experience. As you know, it was actually during the time of the recession. So it was an interesting time because I was coming fresh out of college. And as most of my colleagues were, unfortunately, losing their jobs. I went from being you know, Junior junior to senior within a year. So, you know, I was working in homes of Tommy Hilfiger, Regis Philbin like just exorbitant amount of wealth and you know, what people would spend on just the lifestyle was was so fascinating to be surrounded by that much that much money really and the access to it so you know, and worked refirming Greenwich Connecticut So anyways, really just got to see how well People lived and what it was like, and went on to work closely with them for most of my career, as I mentioned, you know, not only do I do residential design, but I also did over probably about a million square feet of commercial office space in both New York and California. And ultimately, you know, what ended up happening was I, I got burned out, like most people do. And I was in my late 20s, I thought that by achieving a certain number of income, and by having X amount of dollars in my bank account was going to be like, ultimate happiness. And, in fact, it was quite the opposite. I was, you know, physically didn't feel well mentally didn't feel well, my phone was ringing all the time, I was stressed out managing, you know, 510 $15 million projects and chasing running around New York City. And at that point, I said to myself, there has to be a better way to do this thing called life. And like most people, you know, this was probably three years ago, I was really got into the podcast, bigger pockets was, of course, big at the time, was indulging in books and podcasts. And you know, you name it, I was, I was into it. And I figured, okay, well, again, I knew I wanted to get into multifamily, but I wasn't quite sure how, so I made the mistake of flipping homes, he did a couple of those.


Brian Briscoe 06:22

I love I love I love how you put it, I made the mistake of flipping homes. So


Chelsea Garber 06:25

yeah, I can I could spend the whole podcast talking about why not to go into single family. And, and ultimately, you know, and I shouldn't say, there's a nation, everybody has their specialty, you know, I I loved the, the single family flips for a couple of reasons. One I got to work with, you know, take my background and you know, professional working on home remodels. And I eliminated the end user, I got to work with, you know, with contractors and all the trades people and brokers. And, you know, it taught me a lot of valuable lessons, I was flipping houses in Birmingham, Alabama, I was living in New York at the time getting ready to move to California, you know, so learning out of state, you know, going to the market, you know, building a team, and ultimately, there was just a lot of stress and not a lot of money and nothing about it, and in my mind was scalable to the solutions that I wanted to be at nor you know, financially made sense, and it was a stressful situation. So after that experience, I moved to California, I was like, um, you know, I'm getting into multifamily. I joined microblogs mentorship program, and as we discussed that we you know, that's where we met. And, you know, from there, I really got to learn the ins and outs of multifamily. And it was really eye opening. I think initially, I thought, you know, the first thing you go into it, and you only know what you know, so I thought, Oh, this is going to be great. Like, I'm going to become this full time multifamily investor. And, you know, I understand that it takes some hard work, but you know, I can get a deal done. So really, for the first year and going through Michael's program, you know, worked closely with, with my mentor, who I absolutely adore, and still speak with regularly, but I really thought I could I could take down these properties by myself, you know, like a one 2 million something smile. And that really wasn't the case. And I think when I met you, Brian in person at his event was was really eye opening to see all these amazing partnerships that people had been forming. And they were taking down bigger deals and, you know, networking, and I realized I was like I've been doing this all wrong, like thinking that I could just do this on my own and raise some capital and not to say that I couldn't have but you know, I wasn't really quite aware of, of this being such a it's just a such a great community and resource and everybody wants to help one another. So I actually met my now business partners like Tate steamer and call York from greenlight equity group at Michael blocks event, which was, again almost will be two years ago this July. And really what happened was, you know, I, I kept in touch with Tate particularly and saw him online and you're living the best life you know, you're skiing on powder days, your mountain bike riding, you're working on these, like new development projects, Landon teittleman. And in any event, you know, he was definitely a couple steps ahead of me in the business. And we basically about this past summer I you know, I was in a situation where I was ready to, you know, move, I didn't know where I want to go. I was like calaf I'd been in California for almost a year and a half, two years, everything with COVID had just kind of gone to crap, like the world was falling apart. And I was like, You know what, Now's my chance, like, I'm going to move out to Utah. I live in parks today. And this is a great opportunity to sync up with, you know, the guys at Green light and bring my resources which were, you know, broker relations and deal sourcing capital and kind of round off the team and how can we work together and, and that's kind of you know, in the last six months, out six months now, you know, really where we've mainly been focused on is You know, acquiring larger properties, you know, 50 100 plus units. And, and I really have to say that I couldn't have gotten there without the networking and the partnerships and just kind of fully indulging and also on top of that, I did realize in that first year of the mentorship program that okay, you know, they kind of sell you nothing It gets Michael wants mentorship program, I don't know what they sold you on. But when I got on they, they said, Oh, yeah, you know, if you get 100 unit property in your first year, like, they're like, quit your job, they literally told me to quit my job, like, don't take on any more projects Don't do this. And I was like, oh, that would be great. I don't want to do any more design projects. And that wasn't the case. So I am not quite far from it. I'm sure that guy's probably fired, but


Chelsea Garber 10:48

not you should.


Chelsea Garber 10:51

So you know, kind of interestingly, what did happen, though, is COVID, hit deal flow kind of came to a stop, people didn't know what was going on in the markets. You know, at that point, I had been going to Oklahoma, which is, you know, where we invest in where my target markets, built up my teams, everything was was ready to strike. And it kind of was like, Well, now what right? I think we were all kind of sitting in the same spot, like, Are we going to sit on the sidelines? Are we going to do something? So I said, You know what, now's actually the perfect time to have sort of this rebirth of my design business. And what came out of COVID, for me was, you know, a couple things was number one, I you know, ROI by design, which is my multifamily design firm that works with multifamily investors on largely C class value, add opportunities, so everything from exterior design, interior design, rebranding, repositioning, you name it, we're doing new development projects as well. But you know, that just kind of really realigned me with the people that were doing deals and I'm talking 2000 3000 4000, geez, even have a client now who's the guy is younger than me, I think it's got 6000 doors. Imagine that. So selfishly, I got myself a lot closer to the people that were getting things done and in return was and are helping people on, on their properties write to come up with better solutions to get higher returns and, and so it was really just more of the first time in my life, I felt really aligned with my passion for multifamily my knowledge in construction design remodeling, and brought those two together. And, you know, so within the last six months, you know, have had six to nine months should say, you know, really just had a new business vertical that totally took off. And it's been extremely successful. And I formed a partnership with two great guys here in Utah. And we have, you know, quite a few doors, you know, under our belt, and quite a quite a few in front of us. So it's been an exciting ride. But I will say it, it was a lot of patience and a lot of persistence. Like it took nearly almost two years to get into my first deal. And every day just just chipped away at something, it was a little thing some days, I could spend more times other days I could spend less but ultimately getting to the place where I am now I would just say to you know all the listeners that it doesn't happen overnight, some people it does sooner rather than later. And some people can go quit their w two job right away. And I just happened to keep a couple things in the fire because I like multiple streams of income and whatnot. But yeah, and, you know, high level where I'm at kind of how I got there. Yes, certainly dive into some of those details.


Brian Briscoe 13:23

Yeah, I mean, there's a lot of goodness there. First of all, you know, with with my experience, it wasn't until I partnered with people for we started having success when it was Brian Briscoe working by himself, you know, I was getting a lot of doors closed, you know, a lot of doors slammed in my face, you know, hypothetically, you know, but, or really it was unreturned phone calls and, and you know, unreturned emails and whatnot, but and then into your other point, so something something I actually wanted to dive in a little more on is just the ROI by design concept, because I think it's it's a very valuable tool. And, you know, correct me if I'm wrong, I mean, my understanding is you come in you help people plan the renovations, up to the shopping list, you tell them everything they need to buy to install it. Can you tell us a little bit about the process how that works? And you obviously you've already talked about how valuable it is other people just want to dive in a little bit more about process, how it works and how how people can use it.


Chelsea Garber 14:18

Yeah, definitely. So we work with investors nationally, and on projects nationally, assets 20, we've done up to 200 units and essentially we act as a consultant right, as a professional design team. We come in and based upon your budget and scope of work, we put together a full exterior interior package. Again, depending if that's your scope, but typically per se, you know, exterior would you know include, let's say paint colors or wood accents hardscaping and landscaping suggestions, new signage and Wayfinding rebranding, coming up with a new name, color scheme and to follow Interior remodels. right we'll make selections from everything from flooring to paint colors to appliances to plumbing as well as exterior amenity spaces and we're adding what are some really cost effective things here? You know, game courts game courts are easy to make dog parks. It depends on your, your demographic and again, what your budget is we're redesigning clubhouses and leasing offices and furnishing them. So it's really a one stop shop for everything multifamily, you know, remodeling, and we work for a flat fee. And again, that's our fees are relatively low, just to give you an idea on costs, because people, you know, obviously, was the burning question. We're doing full exterior interior packages anywhere from seven to $10,000. And that calls out a shopping list with all the materials, places that you're already probably shopping at, we'll work with local vendors, we'll partner up you know, again, it comes back to being a team sport, we're just another tool in the tool belt, you know, how can we set your asset up for success really, you know, really that I think that the company came to life when I saw so many properties and so much money going into them and the end result wasn't necessarily what I believed was the best return on your investment hence ROI by design was boring. Yeah, we're we've got about anywhere from at least 20 to 30 projects under our belt now and major cities secondary markets, tertiary markets, so we're happy to work with people our values are our mission is to help as many investors as possible increase the return on your investment through cost effective design remodeling solutions, and that's what we do and you know, we put together design packages and renderings and all that fun stuff on tangible materials to paint colors to touch and feel and see so it's fun and we just love what we do. Awesome. Yeah, and everybody listening we're gonna put a link to the website in the show notes so if you're interested in any of that check out the show notes go to the website contact Chelsea and and and go with it and quite quite frankly I mean the the number you spit out as your your fee when you're doing a you know 100 unit 200 unit property it's a drop in the bucket I mean that that's something that's well worth the the service that's that you provide so you I think it's an amazing service. Love it and you know, shopping lists and everything you know just click by click by click Buy super easy.


Brian Briscoe 17:20

So that said let's let's shift gears one question I always like to ask everyone is what their motivation is and I call it the big burning why so Chelsea, what's your big burning? Why?


Chelsea Garber 17:31

So my motivation is definitely I think like most people is putting money aside is time right time to do the things that I love. I am an avid skier, I have recently got back into horseback riding, I'm going to start competing again. So you know, to get to that level, it requires money and it requires time, a lot of both. And you know, and my goal is you know, at this point I don't have a family but I'd like to set up a portfolio with you know, passive both passive and active investments that give me the opportunity to to have all the time to things to do all the things that I love, travel ski ride horses, spend time with my family. And and really I just I love everything multifamily. It's you know, it's for me, it's not like oh, let's retire in 10 years it's let's keep doing this and create more time more money in my opinion, you're in the best place in the world for a lot of those activities you


Brian Briscoe 18:28

said so you know, I grew up a stone's throw from Park City you know, just the other side of the mountains in the Salt Lake Valley but best skiing in the world right there. And I'm guessing you and Tate every once in a while you hit the slopes together right?


Chelsea Garber 18:42

Oh for sure. We're we're definitely living our best mountain lives out here. I mean, apparently this is a thing here that you have I know people that I ski with having their contracts that on powder days, they can show up late to work I honestly don't have a contract with myself and it was just so epic to go there was like nothing like getting the day started skiing and 18 inches of fresh snow and showing up for my first zoom at 1030 like like the best day ever.


Brian Briscoe 19:11

I had a I had a teacher at grad school I was at University of Utah which you know once again just just right by parties Canyon up to park city but during the winter semester he would only teach afternoon classes for that reason and there there are several times he would literally show up still wearing his you know his ski pants and his his ski coat had just be like first five minutes of the class was like oh man, you know skiing today he had like the back country passes and everything but yeah, that's that's what I want to do. I'm going to be you know, skiing A lot of you know Idaho mountains in the future but eventually I'll get down and you know, maybe you even take and go ski, you know, Park City or Snowbird or something like that, but be a lot of fun. So Chelsea switching gears again, let's talk about one of the deals you guys have done or have coming up and give the listeners an idea of what you and your Team do.


Chelsea Garber 20:01

Yep. So we invest in C class value add multifamily, and typically 50 100 Plus, I'd say 100 is 100. Plus is the sweet spot. Right now our target markets, our Oklahoma City, Tulsa, and Ohio, Columbus, you know, we just put a new deal under contract in Oklahoma City 51 unit, really great deal, because actually, the broker that we're working with is purchasing the property next door, they're about to close on. And we are going to rebrand and reposition these two assets together as a 93 unit property. So we're gonna really gain here from the scalability of operating and selling as a as a portfolio. So we're really excited about that. And we have an LSI out right now on 350 plus unit property, we're just really just take things to the next level and hoping you know, to scale quickly, and our goal is 2500 doors in Oklahoma in the next two years. And guys that start with one and get on track. Yeah,


Brian Briscoe 21:04

I mean, it always starts with one and I know you guys have gotten several under contract recently and close on a couple. And, you know, incidentally, you know, Tate's coming on the podcast, you know, next week, so we'll get to talk more in detail about some of those, hopefully, when he comes on next week that that, you know, lol has turned into a contract. But but we'll see about that. But good. Good luck with that one. And just curious. A lot of people talk, you know, sunbelt states, you know, what, what do you guys like about Columbus?


Chelsea Garber 21:32

I can't speak as much on Columbus as taikang because he's from there. And he, you know, he also was partners there I can, I can speak all day about Oklahoma and the strong, slow, steady economy. But Columbus in Oklahoma, I think are very, they share a lot of similarities, you know, influx of people, rent growth, low unemployment, just relatively inexpensive places to live with good quality of life. So author on the very much upward trajectory with no stopping in sight. And and I can say for sure that both have, you know, just very low supply and high demand in the C class assets. So we're bullish on both,


Brian Briscoe 22:13

you know, and having a partner that's from Columbus, you know, that's that's key right there. That's a competitive advantage. A lot of people don't have Incidentally, there. There's a couple investors that live out here in DC that are also have their eyes on Columbus. So not necessarily an anomaly. I just don't know much about it. So thanks for that. And I'll definitely hit Tate with that question. Next week. You know, why Columbus,


Chelsea Garber 22:35

but yeah, he's from Cincinnati, which is super close. But Columbus is the hot market there.


Brian Briscoe 22:41

Sounds good. All right.


Brian Briscoe 22:42

Now,


Brian Briscoe 22:43

last question before we bring him on. What's next for you?


22:48

What's next for me? Well,


22:49

you know, like I said before, it might be a little repetitive but 2500 doors and in Oklahoma. So that's going to be new partnership, new capital sources, new off market deals, and you know, laying one brick at a time to get there.


Brian Briscoe 23:05

Yeah. So So what's next for you is continuing to do what you've been doing? Simple. Yeah. Yeah.


Chelsea Garber 23:11

You got it.


Brian Briscoe 23:12

There you go.


Chelsea Garber 23:13

Yeah. And spending more time doing it.


Brian Briscoe 23:15

Yeah, I like the analogy one brick at a time, you know, it's your you're building a wall, you're just placing a brick down. You know, each each, each individual brick by itself may not seem like a lot, but you keep on doing it over and over again. And you can build a lot. So, you know, let's shift gears again. And we got Kimberly on the call with us. So Kim, welcome.


Kimberly McCall 23:35

Thank you for having me. It's my pleasure. Yeah, this


Brian Briscoe 23:38

is this is a lot of fun. Glad to have. Yes. So now, incidentally, just want to touch on this briefly. Just just so everybody who's listened to this knows that. You know, Kim's calling from her car right now. Tell us why you're calling from that car.


Kimberly McCall 23:51

I have five wonderful rambunctious children at home. they would they would ask me for everything under the sun. As soon as they hear my voice talking. They want mom. Like if I'm just quiet working at my desk, they leave me alone. Soon as I start talking to someone, they're like, Oh, hi. Oh, my. My two year old. I swear he loves it. He wants to be on every zoom call. He's like, pieces headed.


Brian Briscoe 24:22

Yeah, my youngest. My youngest is five and internet. We have five kids too, but a little little older than your five kids. But my five year old has been on many zoom calls. And a lot of times, she'll just come in and sit on my lap. And you know, as I'm finishing up calls, and I think my wife knows, I mean, she has access to my calendar on on the phone. So I think she knows my last call today is and she probably sends my daughter down to her mind. Yeah, I totally understand that. But you know, thanks. Thanks for, you know, doing what you do to get on the podcast today. It's it's something I appreciate, but


Kimberly McCall 24:57

I'm excited.


Brian Briscoe 24:58

Yeah, that's it. Let's Let's talk about you tell us about yourself and your background and lead us up to what got you into multifamily?


Kimberly McCall 25:07

Well, it's so funny, I'm so glad and so honored to be on with Chelsea, you sent the bio. So, of course immediately have to look her up. And I feel like we were destined to be on this on this call together. But my husband is a he's in construction. And he's been doing it for a while. I of course been kind of a stay at home mom, but you know, I would watch one too many, you know, HGTV shows. And, you know, we decided to single family houses. Yeah, and we started there. And oh, my goodness. So you guys are well, our Chelsea, I shared that with us. It was hilarious. I like oh my god. Yeah, we know, we did we wanted we wanted to make a different my part was like the design, I got to pick colors and pretty things and make a beautiful I went on your your profile. I was like, I loved it. The the bottoms. I want to beautify, you know, these properties in the community. And I noticed that, like, once we flipped a house and it looked great. You see the neighbors, you know, sprucing up theirs, and it has a lasting effect. So there was good things. But a lot, we learned fast that that wasn't, that wasn't the way that was not. I think our biggest mistake when it came to flipping, which is actually I receive it as a blessing in disguise that we didn't, we didn't do teams, we didn't create a team for flipping, we we did a lot ourselves. So we had, you know, five, four kids, mostly at that time in the houses doing demo. And we, you know, we they'd come help me pick colors and carpet and all the good stuff. And we did it ourselves. And it took a lot out of us. It took a lot of my husband, he works a full time job. With flip, he would he would go from working full time to go into the to the house to flip in some days, there was 24 hour, he was on the clock all like throughout the night and in the morning and back to work. And so I think it put them in it. But no, I don't think I know it put him in the hospital. And he was like, you know, having some heart issues. And I was like, This is not the way this is not the way so I just kept learning and podcast, I was still on that track of of learning, reading, you know, tons of books, just you know, just like Chelsea mentioned and and then I came across multifamily. Or we took a class once on mobile home parks. And I seen this lady, she was a fantastic teacher. And then later we asked the one of the contacts in the business we said, you know, where does she go? I know she's not with your company. They mentioned that she went she was with Dave Linda's program. So we followed her we've she probably is not even aware. But we followed her there because she has such great teaching and that's how we got into multifamily. Just you know, the Hard Knocks of single family flips and, and just continuing to try to grow.


Brian Briscoe 28:21

So So you also made the mistake of flipping houses like Chelsea Yes.


Kimberly McCall 28:25

Nice. Yeah.


Brian Briscoe 28:27

Yeah. So I yeah, we I didn't really flip a house but we we've gotten a couple of our rentals ready for sale. And I, I've had several days where you know, you leave your W two job, you drive straight to the property you work till 9 or 10 o'clock. And, you know, some nights, it's just like, you know what, I'm just gonna sleep on the floor right there, you know, up the next morning drive to work, you know, and yeah, I've done that. And it's, it's not something that I want to keep doing. So. Yeah, so yeah, multifamily, right. So if you could distill your, your big burning y down to, you know, one or two sentences, and what would that be?


Kimberly McCall 29:05

Ah, it definitely aligns with everyone's legacy, wealth and financial freedom. But my biggest why that I hardly share. I'm from an Indian Reservation in Washington State, and I see the housing crisis. There's not a lot of homes there. So I figured if I can make it out here, learn from all these people and resources and networks, maybe I can go home and, and try to help our community with with housing. Yeah.


Brian Briscoe 29:35

Yeah. And that's huge. give back to your community. You know, and, you know, I grew up you know, in and around some of the reservations. You My grandfather spent a lot of time down in Arizona on the reservations and it's, you know, the ones I've seen, it's, it's not a good situation there. There's, there's not a lot of wealth, there's not a lot of resources. So I think that's, that's very, very good of you to give back to that kid. All right, so let's do this. Now let's, let's turn to where I hand the mic over to Kim. And Kim, we got Chelsea here. What do you what do you want to ask her?


Kimberly McCall 30:10

Oh, I had like a I have a list of questions I do. But I will I will kind of try to try to make a brief design. I do. I do want to make the comment Chelsea, I love that about you like the design and beautifying and, and just everything I, I guess when it comes to design to keep it brief and not, you know, gush over how how do you find your contractors? Like that's a big thing to make those teams?


Chelsea Garber 30:39

Yes. So for the design projects, we actually are working, most of the contractors are already in place with the property owners and they've engaged with them and these types of investors have worked on not to say it's not their, you know, 100 deal, but they've done many multifamily deals in the markets that they're working in. So they have their teams lined up. So we're, you know, we'll be a resource if we let's say, in Oklahoma, we're working on projects and you know, now I know contacts there, I'll share it with other investors that are working on projects and like, just like in any business, right if if there are good reputable person, but word of mouth. Yeah.


Kimberly McCall 31:17

Okay, referrals. I love it. I have another question. What about your morning routine? What does that look like?


Chelsea Garber 31:24

That's one of my favorite questions, actually. So I have right now three coaches in the last two months. And for me, like above all else, like mindset and health are the two most important things without your health, you don't have your mind and you don't have anything else. And without your mind the same, right. So I am huge on I wake up every day at five o'clock, I meditate. I have a journal where I write 10 things that I'm grateful for that I have 10 things I'm grateful for that I don't have drink a huge glass of water, I no longer pick up my phone. It's like the last thing I do. And I'll typically just read like a little bit of the news, like 1015 minutes, I'm not I don't watch TV, I am a big avid reader. So So to me, the morning is my quiet time. And then I get do some work for an hour or two and hit the gym every day at about 730 to nine.


Kimberly McCall 32:22

I love it. What? What about your deal criteria I hear Oklahoma City 2500, the doors ranges from 50 to 100 with 100 as your sweet spot, C class value, is there anything else that attracts you or that you'd want to look for in a deal?


Chelsea Garber 32:38

I mean, for us, it's really a deal that I mean off market, right? Where you can find deals that are undervalued, it's it's all like going in on the buy side. So a true off market deal from maybe a mom and pop seller who are in some sort of distress or maybe no distress at all. And we can go in put a third party property management in place, you know, obviously take care of catbacks interior updates and organic you know, bump the rents and sell in three to five years depending on the on the property.


Kimberly McCall 33:14

Okay,


Brian Briscoe 33:15

now I got it. I love it for you Chelsea. What's the competition like in Oklahoma City right now? Is it like everywhere else? Or is it you know, maybe a little little less so than what you see in like a Dallas or Houston.


Chelsea Garber 33:29

I mean, it's definitely not a Dallas Denver. You know, Miami, these huge markets. It's it's very competitive. I've seen a lot change there in the last two years. But there are deals to be found. And I believe that within any market. So we're I mean, we're seeing more compressed cap rates and people overspending but again, that's that's why we've really just built strong relationships with brokers and are looking, you know, off market and doing direct to seller


Kimberly McCall 33:59

Can you know, and we can sum it up fast? But would do you have, like a big mistake or a big success that you can share with us something that we can learn from something that we could implement?


Chelsea Garber 34:12

Yeah, I mean, I think kind of going back, I'd say my first biggest mistake was thinking that I could do this alone. So I would say number one, like, you know, building teams and your your network is where your wealth is, and adding value, right, going into every conversation that value.


Brian Briscoe 34:29

Yeah, I like that. And, you know, I'll add, you know, assuming too much, you know, some some, on our first deals, I think we assumed that the property manager would take care of certain things, you know, it's like, when you go into without owning anything, you're like, Okay, the property manager should do A, B, C, and D, you know, and making assumptions is probably one of the mistakes that I made was assuming that our property manager would be able to do everything that we expected them to do, and then later find out that they're really good at A and B Not so much see, it can only kind of do D that that was that was a hard lesson for us.


Chelsea Garber 35:05

And I would say, to kind of separately, but to answer the second part of your question, you know, what's been some of the wins. And I would say the real big wins are the relationships that we've built in. And for me, you know, being inexperienced two years ago was showing up in markets and showing that I was serious and going to Oklahoma. And I think, you know, the people in Oklahoma are very nice that I'm a nice woman, and it probably refreshing so I could, I was easily able to have coffee and phone calls. But I continually showed up in those markets to show that I was serious, knowing that I was going to, you know, to buy, and if I couldn't necessarily, you know, hire the property management company, but we spent tons and tons of time working together, I would refer them and you know, say I don't currently have a property with them. But I've spent a lot of time working with them and underwriting and chatting and learning about their business and, you know, that kind of stuff. So go into the market and developing relationships is


36:03

invaluable. That's,


Brian Briscoe 36:04

that's a great point. If you're investing out of state, I think one of the watershed moments in in my so far short investing career, which is going to be a very long investing career was getting in the car and driving to Columbia, South Carolina. It's an eight hour drive. Okay. And up until then, I was just a voice on the phone. But you know, when I sat down with brokers and sat down with property managers, that changed the dynamic, and all of a sudden, it was that triple we got our first deal under contract, you know, and it wasn't during that trip, it was a relationship made on that trip. They ended up getting that first thing under contract. So I think that's huge.


Chelsea Garber 36:40

And just to add on to that, two little things, handwritten note cards is thank you bringing a gift like I bring there's a you know, a chocolate company here in Salt Lake, seep ck Cummings, you might know it, Brian, and bringing just little things just tokens of appreciation to people and it's it goes such a long way.


Brian Briscoe 37:02

Yeah, it's really how to win friends and influence people. That's all it is.


Kimberly McCall 37:06

One of my favorites. Yeah. Well, I definitely want to say thank you Chelsea for your time. I i would i know people investing in Oklahoma City right now well, actually Tulsa, but in the same state. I do know people investing in Oklahoma. And I'll definitely share your contact information if that's okay. And, and I'm, I'm excited. I'm like, Yes. I want to work with Chelsea. I thought like, I love it.


Chelsea Garber 37:35

Now you're you're on the right track. And we'll we'll talk further outside of here. Because anything I can definitely you like, make that leap. Or? I'm happy to and that's awesome. You have a great future ahead.


Brian Briscoe 37:49

Now know what markets are you guys looking in?


Kimberly McCall 37:52

We're in Texas right now. We have we're working on some some things in Texas. We got up our sleeve.


Brian Briscoe 37:59

Yeah, yep. Yeah, I heard and yeah, you're being mom about it. But hopefully we get you back soon. On our first deal episode. Let's put it that way.


Kimberly McCall 38:08

Oh, yes. Yes. We are excited.


Brian Briscoe 38:11

Yes. So that said, Be back. Yep. Love to have Yes. So well, that said we're we're about out of time. You know, thank you, both of you so so much for coming on the podcast. This has been a lot of fun. You know, love loved talking to both of you. I think this is a great, great live conversation that I'd love to continue. But there there's time. Right. So one last question for both of you. Chelsea, you go first, how can listeners learn more about you


Chelsea Garber 38:38

would love to connect, you can find me probably the best way is on LinkedIn, Chelsea Garber, shoot me a message on there. And we can set up a time to speak further. And I have obviously ROI by design, my design firm, which is just www dot ROI dash by design.com. So if you're looking to remodel a property, just need help, you know, with some pointers on paint colors, we've got you covered. And then as far as our investments, greenlight equity groups, so our website is www dot g l equity group COMM And you can sign up there to kind of keep in the know what we're working on and learn more about our team. And


Brian Briscoe 39:25

yeah, like I said, just here to connect and add value and see where synergies exist. If so, what we'll put a we'll put a link to your LinkedIn profile into the URL by ROI by design and your greenlight website in the show notes. Anybody interested? You know, you know where to find it. And Kim, same question for you. how can listeners learn more about you?


Kimberly McCall 39:44

I am also on LinkedIn, Kimberly McCall. I have you know, Facebook, Instagram, but we have a we have a website multifamily value partners calm but definitely LinkedIn is the easiest one as well.


Brian Briscoe 39:58

All right. Awesome.


40:00

From the bottom of my heart,


Brian Briscoe 40:01

thank you so, so much. This was a lot of fun. And yeah, hopefully hopefully we'll talk soon.


Brian Briscoe 40:12

Thank you for listening to the diary of an apartment investor podcast today brought to you by four oaks capital. If you'd like to know more about how to invest in apartment buildings or want to be a guest on our show, visit our website at four oaks capital comm slash podcast or email us directly. If you're still listening, you obviously like the show. So pull out your phone, tap, subscribe, and leave us a five star rating on your favorite podcast app. And we'll see you again next week.

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